Ramanisblog

Tag: Dravidian Languages

  • Eighty Varities Of Dravidian Tamil Among Indian Tribes

    Among the ancient languages of India, Sanskrit and Tamil are more ancient others.While Tamil is conventionally placed at 3000 back, Sanskrit @ 5000 BC,that is Rig Veda.Here Convention means ‘Western Scholars and Indian Secular/ Left Historians’.India has the dubious honour of providing to lexicon terms like Left,Secular Historians!

    Based on recent excavations in Poompuhar,Tamil Nadu,the date of Tamil is pushed back to atleast 12,000 years ago.Sanskrit goes back further. Important factor to note is that Tamil and Sanskrit run parallel and each quote the other.An ancient Tamil site in Chennai,Tamil Nadu is about a million years old and I had written on this.Such an ancient language Tamil quotes Sanskrit and in turn Tamil quotes Sanskrit again! So, it is futile to determine their dates as it goes back to lo…….ng back,which defies comprehension.When one reads History of world, Tamil and Sanatan dharma were most ancient and they have influenced world civilizations in some form or other.And all world languages trace their origins to either Tamil or Sanskrit.

    Dravidian Language Family presence among Tribes, India

    History of Tamil is mind-boggling.Atlantis ,Mayan civilization,apart from others speak of Tamil or MU civilization .And the land of Tamils , unfortunately named after an animal as Lemuria,is at least 230 Millions years old and Himalayas was not formed then.

    So it is not surprising to know that Tamil has over 80 Variations being spoken by Tribes in the world.One can find Tamil words in Cameroon!

    The Dravidian language family consists of about 80 varieties (Hammarström H. 2016 Glottolog 2.7) spoken by 220 million people across southern and central India and surrounding countries (Steever SB. 1998 In The Dravidian languages (ed. SB Steever), pp. 1–39: 1). Neither the geographical origin of the Dravidian language homeland nor its exact dispersal through time are known. The history of these languages is crucial for understanding prehistory in Eurasia, because despite their current restricted range, these languages played a significant role in influencing other language groups including Indo-Aryan (Indo-European) and Munda (Austroasiatic) speakers. Here, we report the results of a Bayesian phylogenetic analysis of cognate-coded lexical data, elicited first hand from native speakers, to investigate the subgrouping of the Dravidian language family, and provide dates for the major points of diversification. Our results indicate that the Dravidian language family is approximately 4500 years old, a finding that corresponds well with earlier linguistic and archaeological studies. The main branches of the Dravidian language family (North, Central, South I, South II) are recovered, although the placement of languages within these main branches diverges from previous classifications. We find considerable uncertainty with regard to the relationships between the main branches.# Research paper may be downloaded at the following Link.

    https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsos.171504

    In the historical past Proto-Dravidian was spoken throughout India. When the Turanians and the Aryans came to India through the Khyber and the Bolan Passes respectively, and mingled with the local population of the North, the North Indian languages of Proto-Dravidian origin changed to a great extent. As a consequence Praakrit and Paali emerged as the languages of the masses in the northern part of India. Despite the commingling of local and foreign ethnic elements, a section of Proto-Dravidians maintained their ethnic and cultural identity in some isolated areas, spoke corrupt forms of Proto-Dravidian languages and these have survived, to this day, as living examples of ancient Dravidian languages. Languages such as Kolami, Parji, Naiki, Gondi, Ku, Kuvi, Konda, Malta, Oroan, Gadba, Khurukh, and Brahui are examples of Dravidian languages prevalent in the North. Today Proto-Dravidian speakers are increasingly mingling with other linguistic groups and learning their languages. Therefore, their numerical strength is on the decline. People living in the Rajmahal mountains in Bengal and in the areas adjacent to Chota Nagpur are good examples of the intermingling. A section of people living in Baluchistan speak Brahui, which has many linguistic features similar to the Dravidian languages spoken in South India. Scholars are surprised today to note many linguistic similarities between Tamil and Brahui, especially in numerals, personal pronouns, syntax and in other linguistic features. The Indian Census report of 1911 classified Brahui as a language belonging to the Dravidian family. It was then spoken by about 170, 000 people, although this number over the years dwindled to a couple of thousands. Whatever be their numerical strength now, they are proof of the fact that the Dravidians in some age of the historical past were spread in the region between Baluchistan and Bengal and spoke the Proto-Dravidian idiom.

    North Indian Languages

    Since the Dravidians lived throughout the Indian subcontinent at some historical past, certain syntactical affinities are noticeable even today between the South and a large number of North Indian languages. […]

    The term Dravidian, which refers to the language of South India, is of a later origin. Originally it was derived from the word tamil /tamiz> . This word in course of time changed into dravida after undergoing a series of changes like tamiza, tramiza, tramiTa, trapida and travida. At one time the languages spoken in the regions of Karnataka, Kongu and Malabar were respectively known as Karunaattut-tamil, Tulunattut-tamil and Malainattut-tamil. Today however, these regional languages are classified under the blanket term “Dravidian family of languages”.

    https://indiantribalheritage.org/?p=16288

    Source: Tamil Cultural Assocation – Tamil Language
    Address : http://www.tamilculturewaterloo.org/tamillanguage.htm
    Date Visited: Sat Nov 22 2014 12:

    Of the Dravidian languages, Tamil has the greatest geographical extension and the richest and most ancient literature, which is paralleled in India only by that of Sanskrit. Its phonological and grammatical systems correspond in many points to the ancestral parent language, called Proto-Dravidian.

    Nothing definite is known about the origin of the Dravidian family. There are vague indigenous traditions about an ancient migration from the south, from a submerged continent in what is now the Indian Ocean. According to some scholars, Dravidian languages are indigenous to India. In recent years, a hypothesis has been gaining ground that posits a movement of Dravidian speakers from the northwest to the south and east of the Indian Peninsula, a movement originating possibly from as far away as Central Asia. Another theory connects the Dravidian speakers with the peoples of the Indus Valley civilization. The Dravidian languages have remained an isolated family to the present day and have defied all of the attempts to show a connection with the Indo-European tongues, Mitanni, Basque, Sumerian, or Korean. The most promising and plausible hypothesis is that of a linguistic relationship with the Uralic (Hungarian, Finnish) and Altaic (Turkish, Mongol) language groups.

    As an independent family, the Dravidian languages were first recognized in 1816 by Francis W. Ellis, a British civil servant. The actual term Dravidian was first employed by Robert A. Caldwell, who introduced the Sanskrit word dravida (which, in a 7th-century text, obviously meant Tamil) into his epoch-making A Comparative Grammar of the Dravidian or South Indian Family of Languages (1856).

    Tamil is spoken by 39,400,000 people (1981 est.) in the Indian state of Tamil Nadu, by another 2,697,000 in Sri Lanka (Ceylon), by smaller numbers of people in Burma, Malaysia, Indonesia, and Vietnam (about 1,400,000), in East and South Africa (almost 250,000), and by still smaller numbers in Guyana and on the islands of Fiji, Mauritius, Réunion, Madagascar, Trinidad, and Martinique. The earliest literary monuments of the language belong roughly to the 3rd and 2nd centuries BC. There exist a number of local dialects, the major dialect regions being the northern and eastern areas combined, the western area, the southern area (split into at least four major dialects of Madurai, Tirunelveli, Nanjiland, and Ramnad), and Sri Lanka (Ceylon). Correlated with the social position of the speaker are a number of speech forms; a major division occurs between the Brahmin and the non-Brahmin varieties. In addition, there is a sharp dichotomy between the formal language and informal speech.

    Malayalam, which is closely related to Tamil, is spoken in the Indian state of Kerala by some 21,700,000 people. Possessing an independent written script, it also has a rich modern literature. There are at least three main regional dialects (North, Central, South) of Malayalam and a number of communal dialects.

    http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/~haroldfs/sars238/encybrit.htmlthe Nilgiris and adjacent regions, several minor tribes speak the following languages: Kota (1,400), Toda (1,145), Badaga (128,500), Irula (Irula) (6,176). The less well-known languages of a number of other tribes may yet be established as independent members of the Dravidian family (e.g., Kurumba, Paniya) http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/~haroldfs/sars238/encybrit.html

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  • Brahui Language Balochisthan Dravidian ,Dravida Invasion of India?

    Brahui Language Balochisthan Dravidian ,Dravida Invasion of India?

    I have written articles on Dravidas ,stating that,

    They lived side by side the Sanatana Dharma,

    Tamil Brahmi script is found in Indus valley civilisation,

    Tamil King Sibi ruled from what is now NWFP in Pakistan,

    Chera King Udhiyan Cheralaathan fed both the Kaurava and Pandya armies during the Mahabharatha War,

    Lord Krishna attended Tamil Sangam,married a Pandyan Princess and had a daughter through her,

    The children of Sage Viswamitra were banished by him to Dravida Desa,

    Arjuna,Balarama and Sahadeva went on a Pilgrimage to Dravida Desa,

    Lord Rama’s sister’s Rishyashrunga was from Sringeri,Karnataka,

    Sage Gautama,after whom the river Godavari is named,was from Godavari valley,Anshra Pradesh,

    There was a King Aryaman whose ancestry is traced to Manu,

    Cholas were cousins of Solar,Ikshvahu Dynasty,to which Lord Rama belongs,

    Cholas,Pandyas are referred to in Ramayana and Mahabharatha,

    Manu’s daughter was married to a Dravidian King,

    Manu was from Dravida desa and he meditated near Madagascar…..

    What is interesting is that Brahui language is spoken in Balochisthan even today.

    And it is a Dravidian language.

    How come The Dravidian languages spoken in the south of India,about 1000 miles away is being spoken in Baluchisthan?

    One theory is that this Brahui was from Central India.

    Does it not mean that Dravidiian languages were spoken in Central India as well?

    One may have to visit the Gondwana continent concept to clarify this.

    Please read my article on Gondwana.

    One must bear in mind that the landmass of India and the world were different.

    When one studies the Dravidian literature in conjunction with Sanatana Dharma,one may uncover shocking facts.

    Looks as though the Dravidian culture preceded Sanatana Dharma.

    But this theory goes out of the window because Tamil literature quotes Vedas,Puranas,Ramayana and Mahabharatha and these texts quote Tamil/s!

    One is stumped.

    Add to this the excavation of a million year old site in Chennai,where traces of advanced Tamil civilization is found.

    Poompuhar sites push the date of Tamils by 30,000 years.

    More sites,numbering 293 in Vaigai River near Madurai confirm the antiquity as found in the other sites mentioned above.

    My view on Brahui being present in Balochisthan is due to the presence of Tamils in these areas when kings from Tamil Nadu invaded them.

    There are three kings who have been credited with invading North,not to speak about those who had friendly relations with the people of Sanatana Dharma.

    They are,

    Aryavarman,

    Ariyappadaikadantha Nedunchezhiyan

    Imayavaramban Neduncheralaathaan.

    I am researching on who the first Tamil king ,who invaded The North of India.

    I am reproducing some theories,one of which suggests Dravidian Invasion of India.

    Shall examine this theory as well later.

    ‘The Brahui (Brahui: براہوئی,) or Brahvi people are a Pakistani ethnic group of about 2.2 million people with the vast majority found in Baluchistan, Pakistan.They are a small minority group in Afghanistan, where they are native, but they are also found through their diaspora in Middle Eastern states..

    Brahvi[4] /brəˈhuːiBrahui: براہوئی‎‎) is a Dravidian language spoken by the Baloch[citation needed] and Brahvi people in the central Balochistan region of Pakistan and Afghanistan, and by expatriate Brahvi communities in Qatar, United Arab Emirates, Iraq, and Iran.It is isolated from the nearest Dravidian-speaking neighbour population of South India by a distance of more than 1,500 kilometres (930 mi). Kalat, Mastung Khuzdar and parts of Quetta districts of Balochistan are predominantly Brahvi-speaking…

    Source. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahui_people

    ‘When one looks at the many similarities between certain Brahui words and words used in other Dravidian languages, the connection is clear. In addition to arisi and uru, a few more Brahui words that are clearly Dravidian in origin are listed below:

    Today – Aino (Brahui), Innu (Tamil, Malayalam)

    You – Ne (Brahui), Ne (Tamil, Malayalam)

    Come – Baa (Brahui), Vaa (Tamil, Malayalam)

    Snore – Khurkao (Brahui), Khurtai (Tamil)

    Eye – Xan (Brahui), Kan (Tamil)

    Stone – Xal (Brahui), Kal (Tamil)

    Milk – Pal (Brahui), Pal (Tamil)

    News – Haval (Brahui), Thahaval (Tamil)

    For its numbering system, Brahui draws from a Dravidian source for two (irat akin to the Kannada eradu) and three (musit akin to the Tamil moonu and the Kannada mooru) but from four onwards, the words are clearly Indo-Aryan borrowings (char, paanch and so on). The Brahui word for one (asit) seems to have no connection with any other language. Owing to its long isolation from other Dravidian languages, Brahui morphology has drawn greatly from those around it. Some experts opine that only about 15% of its vocabulary is now Dravidian, with the remaining drawn from Balochi, Persian, Sindhi, Urdu and other languages in its vicinity. Brahui’s vowel system is drawn entirely from Baloch. But experts have also noted that Baloch words, too, have been drawn from Brahui. ..

    Source. http://www.livemint.com/Sundayapp/lWCoIZ2K5dPycrhS1gk6nJ/A-slice-of-south-India-in-Balochistan.html

    ‘Some consider the Brahui tribe as a left behind relic group of the original Dravidian invaders. This view is supported by an eminent Dravidian linguist, M.S.Andronov (1980).

    During the historical migration of the forebears of the modern Dravidians into India. the ancestors of the Brahuis were the first to separate from the bulk of the proto-Dravidian tribes moving to the south and south-east. “The Brahui language” [translated from the Russian by V. Korotky].

    Source. https://www.quora.com/Why-is-the-Brahui-language-classified-as-a-Dravidian-language-Why-is-it-geographically-isolated-from-all-the-other-Dravidian-languages

    Route of Dravidian movement. Image
    Dravidians moved from Northwest of India into India.

  • 5000 Years Mummy Spoke Indian Language Otzi Mummy Voice

    A well preserved Mummy of an Iceman was found in Otzi Alps, Italian-Austrian Alps about twenty five years ago.

    File:OetzitheIceman.jpg
    Ötzi the Iceman, now housed at the South Tyrol Museum of Archaeology in Bolzano, Italy

    The Otzi Man reconstructed.
    Naturalistic reconstruction of Ötzi – South Tyrol Museum of Archaeology

    Scientists and Archaeologists  dated the mummy ,

    ‘ around 3,300 BCE, more precisely between 3359 and 3105 BCE, with a 66 percent chance that he died between 3239 and 3105 BCE’.

    { Consider the facts.Rama’s Empire covered the  present Italy/Austria.

    The Mitanni Empire covered what is now known as Iraq, Turkey Syria, Lebanon,Egypt and included Italy.

    They were the ancestors of these people.

    Mitanni were the ancestors of the Egyptians as well.

    “The first Mitanni king was Sutarna I (good sun). He was followed by Baratarna I (or Paratarna great sun), Parasuksatra(ruler with axe),…. Saustatar (Sauksatra, son of Suksatra, the good ruler), Artadama (abiding in cosmic law)..Tushratta (Dasaratha), and finally Matiwazza (Mativaja, whose wealth is thought) during whose lifetime the Mitanni state appears to have become a vassal to Assyria”. Subhash Kak traces the ‘arna’ syllable in the names of the kings to ‘araNi’ (अरणि) meaning ‘sun’

    https://ramanisblog.in/2015/06/12/hindu-kings-of-iraq-turkey-syria-lebanon-egypt-italy-mitanni-empire/

    Sharada Devi in Sardinia.

    the term yavana denoted an Ionian Greek”.(3) On pages 83–5 she makes mention of early Indian literature where foreigners were dubbed “yavana”, and points to an Asokan inscription where a border-people is given this appellation. In central and western India, she says, Yavana “figure prominently as donors to the Buddhist Sangha”.

    Considering these facts it is not surprising to find the name Sharada , called as Sarda in Sardinia, Italy.

    Scholars may pursue the issue.

    https://ramanisblog.in/2015/05/16/sharada-devi-in-in-sardinia-italy-greek-hindu-connection/

    Please read my other articles on Sanatana Dharma Mittani, Sumerian, Minoan, and other ancient civilizations like Mayas and Incas.

    And Immigration of world population from India.

    The sounds reproduced by the scientists of The Otzi Mummy  sound closer to Indian languages , more like a Dravidian language, when on hears the pronunciation of long sounds, AA, EE, AE”

    Taking into account the archaeological etymological  and historical eveidence one may safely say that this Otzi Mummy Find corroborates the theory that Hindus were spread throughout the world and the Religion was Sanatana Dharma.

     

    ‘Scientists hailing from Bolzano’s General Hospital, Italy, used CT scans to produce a model of the ice mummy’s mouth, throat, and vocal cords. This allowed them to create a digital reconstruction—or the “best possible approximation”—of Otzi’s voice….

    ‘ The mummy was found in September 1991 in the Ötztal Alps, hence the nickname “Ötzi”, near the Similaun mountain and Hauslabjoch on the border between Austria and Italy.He is Europe’s oldest known natural human mummy, and has offered an unprecedented view of Chalcolithic Europeans. His body and belongings are displayed in the South Tyrol Museum of Archaeology in Bolzano, South Tyrol, Italy….

    “We can’t say we have reconstructed Otzi’s original voice, because we miss some crucial information from the mummy,” Rolando Fustos, the study’s lead researcher, explained to Rossella Lorenzi from Discovery News.

    “But with two measurements, the length of both the vocal tract and the vocal cords, we have been able to recreate a fairly reliable approximation of the mummy’s voice. This is a starting point for further research.”

    He added: “The vocal cords are the source of the vocal sound, but the main contribution to it is given by the selective filtering accomplished by the vocal tract configuration.”

    “Of course, we don’t know what language he spoke 5,000 years ago,” said fellow researcher Francesco Avanzini. “But we should be able to recreate the timbre of his vowel sounds and, I hope, even create simulation of consonants.”

    Reconstructing those vowel sounds presented its own set of challenges. Because MRI scans would have caused Otzi damage, the team opted to use CT scans. Unfortunately, CT scans could only measure the mummy’s internal structure.

    Also adding unnecessary complications was Otzi’s position when he died.

    “We had to deal with Otzi’s position, whose arm is covering his throat,” stated Avanzini. “For our project this is the worst position you can imagine. Moreover, the hyoid bone—or tongue-bone—was party absorbed and dislocated.”

    The scientists used special software to digitally maneuver Otzi’s arm away from his throat, as well as erect his skull. This allowed them to create a model of the vocal tract’s entire physical structure.

    According to researcher Piero Cosi, the team also used mathematical models, and software that “simulates the way the vocal tract works,” to reconstruct information about the throat tissue’s composition and thickness, and the vocal cords’ density and tension.

    The combined data convinced them that the frequency of Otzi’s voice was between 100 and 150 Hz—not too different from the average modern male.

    The team presented the vocalizations at a congress—commemorating the discovery of Otzi in South Tyrol’s Otztal Alps 25 years ago—held at the European Research Academy (EURAC) Institute for Mummies and the Iceman located in Bolzano.

    “This is a new, interesting aspect on Otzi’s research that deserves to be taken into consideration for further research,” stated the EURAC Institute for Mummies and the Iceman director, Albert Zink.

    Genetic analysis

    Ötzi’s full genome has been sequenced; the report on this was published on 28 February 2012.The Y-DNA of Ötzi belongs to asubclade of G defined by the SNPs M201, P287, P15, L223 and L91 (G-L91, ISOGG G2a2b, former “G2a4”). He was not typed for any of the subclades downstreaming from G-L91. G-L91 is now mostly found in South Corsica.

    Analysis of his mitochondrial DNA showed that Ötzi belongs to the K1 subclade, but cannot be categorized into any of the three modern branches of that subclade (K1a, K1b or K1c). The new subclade has provisionally been named K1ö for Ötzi. Multiplex assay study was able to confirm that the Iceman’s mtDNA belongs to a previously unknown European mtDNA clade with a very limited distribution among modern data sets.

    By autosomal DNA, Ötzi is most closely related to southern Europeans, especially to geographically isolated populations like Corsicans and Sardinians.

    DNA analysis also showed him at high risk of atherosclerosis and lactose intolerance, with the presence of the DNA sequence of Borrelia burgdorferi, possibly making him the earliest known human with Lyme disease. A later analysis suggested the sequence may have been a different Borrelia species.

    A 2012 paper by paleoanthropologist John Hawks suggests that Ötzi had a higher degree of Neanderthal ancestry than modern Europeans.

    In October 2013, it was reported that 19 modern Tyrolean men were related to Ötzi. Scientists from the Institute of Legal Medicine at Innsbruck Medical University had analysed the DNA of over 3,700 Tyrolean male blood donors and found 19 who shared a particular genetic mutation with the 5,300-year-old man.

    Blood

    In May 2012, scientists announced the discovery that Ötzi still had intact blood cells. These are the oldest complete human blood cells ever identified. In most bodies this old, the blood cells are either shrunken or mere remnants, but Ötzi’s have the same dimensions as living red blood cells and resembled a modern-day sample.

    H. pylori analysis

    In 2016, researchers reported on a study from the extraction of twelve samples from the gastrointestinal tract of Ötzi to analyze the origins of the Helicobacter pylori in his gut.[The H. pylori strain found in his gastrointestinal tract was, surprisingly, the hpAsia2 strain, a strain today found primarily in South Asian and Central Asian populations, with extremely rare occurrences in modern European populations. The strain found in Ötzi’s gut is most similar to three modern individuals from Northern India; the strain itself is, of course, older than the modern Northern Indian straince

    References and Citations.

    http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/582568/scitech/science/scientists-approximate-otzi-the-stone-age-mummy-s-voice

    http://www.dayofarchaeology.com/spend-a-day-at-your-museum/

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%96tzi#Genetic_analysis

    Image credit.

    Fair use, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?curid=10928855

    Naturalistic reconstruction of Ötzi – South Tyrol Museum of Archaeology

  • Agastya Canopus Validates Sanatan Dharma Tamil Dates

    Sage Agasthya is mentioned in the Rig Veda : in fact he authored hymns 166-190.

     

    He is also mentioned in Tamil Literature, Sangam as well as later works in Tamil.

     

    Star Canopus, Agasthya.jpg
    Star Canopus, Agasthya.

     

    He is credited with the firs grammar book in Tamil,Agathiyam, which was followed by Tholkappiyar later by about 300 years(there is some discussion on this).

     

    The Agastya mentioned in Tamil has been dated somewhere around 3000-5000 BC.

     

    On the other hand, the Agasthya mentioned in the Vedas, Puranas ,Ramayana and Mahabharata is dated earlier.

     

    Agasthya was the one who taught the Adhitya Hrudaya stotra to Lord Rama in the battle field .

     

    Mahabharata recounts the story of Agasthya, Ilvala and Vatapi:Vatapi was swallowed by Agasthya.

     

    Tamil literature says that he was entrusted with the task of spreading Tamil by Lord Shiva who is believed  to have founded Tamil and Shiva was the Chief of the First Tamil Conclave at Then Madurai, which was swallowed by a Tsunami.

     

    This event concurs more with the Times of Ramayana than with the Mahabharata.

     

    Even then this can not account for Agasthya being mentioned in the Rig Veda.

     

    Though earlier studies have indicated that the Rig Veda was composed around 5000 BC, latest researches say that it was composed much earlier, some 25000 years earlier.Please read y post on this.

     

    There are indications that the Rig Veda might have been composed in the Arctic.

     

    I have an article on this.

     

    So we have a confusion.

     

    What is the date of Agasthya?

     

    5000 BC or 25000 BC?

     

    There is also a view that there were more than one Agastya.

     

    Comparison of works in Tamil by Agastya nail this lie perpetrated by the West to misinform the world about the antiquity of Sanatana Dharma and Tamil.

     

    There was only one Agastya. who composed the Rig Vedic Hymns and Tamil Classic Agathiyam.

     

    How does one reconcile this anomaly in dates?

     

    By Astronomy.

     

    Legend of Agasthya states that as he was traveling from the North towards the South, he had to cross the Vindhya Mountains, which was growing quite tall to compete with the Himalayas and it was feared that it would affect the Skyline(Heavens).

     

    The Devas represented this to Agasthya who was the Guru, Teacher of Vindhyas.

     

    So when Agasthya crossed the Vindhyas,it prostrated before Agasthya as a mark of respect and Agastya told the mountain to remain in that position to enable him to cross and recross.

     

    Agasthya crossed over to the south and did not return to the North by Land.

     

    And the Vindhyas remained prostrated.

     

    ( Sage Agasthya traveled to the North from the South by the Sea)  .

     

    There is a Star called Agasthya in Hinduism and it is referred as having been sighted by Agastya; in fact it is named as Agasthya.

     

    It is the Star Canopus.

     

    ‘

    it is possible to
    find the epoch
    of Agastya’s crossing the Vindhyas.
    Here we have a clue that Canopus, the
    second brightest star in the night sky, is
    called Agastya in India. This star is close
    to the ecliptic south pole, having an
    ecliptic latitude of–76°. As the celestial
    poles go round the cliptic poles due to the
    phenomenon of precession of the earth’s
    axis of rotation, this star becomes visible
    from different latitudes on the globe at
    different times. If we assume that for a
    star to be visible at a place its altitude at
    the meridian passage should be at least5°
    , then calculations give the visibility
    curve for Agastya (Canopus), as shown
    in Figure 1 for the various epochs from
    12,000 BC to AD 12,000. We see e
    after, as it was brought more and
    more northwards by precession, it became visible at various places in India, as
    shown in Figure 1. It became visible in the east coast (in the present
    Chennai region) in 8500 BC
    , and in the present day
    Hyderabad in 7200 BC
    , in the Vindhya region in 5200 BC at Delhi in 3100 BC.
    At present it is visible from most
    parts of India for longer or shorter durations. This cycle will repeat after every
    25,725 years.
    If sage Agastya was the first to cross
    the Vindhyas from the north, he would
    have been the first northerner to see the
    star. Hence the star has been named after
    him, just as the Magellanic clouds in the
    southern sky are named after the navigator Magellan,
    who first saw them as he
    sailed southwards.
    This fixes an epoch of 5000 BC
    for sage Agastya. This date is
    based on the assumption that for a star to
    be visible its meridian altitude has to be at least 5°
    . If we make 8°meridian altitude as the criterion for visibility,
    the date of Agastya would be shifted to about
    4000 BC.
    The dates 5000 and 4000 BC
    should therefore bracket the probable epoch
    of Agastya crossing the Vindhyan mountains.’
    Consider these facts.
    1.Some RigVeda Hymns were composed by Agasthya, which has been dated around 27000 earlier.
    2.Agasthya is mentioned in The Ramayana, which quotes the Vedas.
    Ramayana took place in the  Treta Yuga.
    3.Agasthya legend is narrated in the Mahabharata, which took place in the Dwapara Yuga, which is sepaated fro Treta Yuga by thousands of years.
    4.Tamil Classics quote Vedas, Vedas quote Tamil,Tamil is reported to have been founded by Agasthya and he had written the Tamil Classic Agathiyam.
    5.Tamil dates back to over 25000 years according to latest archeological findings.
    Please read my post on this filed under Hinduism,Tamils.
    6.Star Canopus is visible once in 25, 725 Years.
    Therefore, the Star should have been visible once in 25725 years as Celestial objects follow a regular cycle.
    Canopus is mentioned in the Ramayana, Mahabharata and Tamil Literature
    And Agasthya is one person.
    He should have existed at some point of time every 25725 years, at least once.
    The Time scale of Hindus is four Yugas.

    Four Yugas of Hinduism.png
    Four Yugas of Hinduism

    One Canopus sighting per 25, 000 years .

     

    Each Yuga should have had as many Sightings of Canopus as there are/were 250000 Years.

     

    Conjoin this with Cyclic Theory of Time according to Hinduism which is now being accepted as a reasonable estimate of Time scale.

     

    Please read y post on the Cyclic theory of Time, under Astrophysics.

     

    We arrive at the conclusions.

     

    1.Agasthya existed in Ramayana, Purana ,Mahabharata and Times.

     

    He also existed at the time quoted by Tamil Classics.

     

    2.This validates that Tamil and Sanatana Dharma were interlinked.

     

    3.That Time is Cyclic and the events occur in Cycles.

     

    4.Tamil Language is as old as Sanskrit.

     

    5..Agasthya existed around 5000 BC and around 25725 years before that.

     

    Citation. Check for Images , calculations.

     

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  • References To Kannada In Tamil and Sanskrit

    This Post is to explore the references made to Kannada in Vedas, Ancient Tamil Literature  like Tholkaappiiyam Sanagam Poems.

    There seems to be no mention of Kannada in Vedas Ramayana or Mahabharata.

    Vellore Inscriptions
    Tamil and Kannada Inscriptions in Vellore

    The earliest Kannada  literature  is from the Western Ganga Dynasty(350-999 AD)

    Tamil and Kannada Languages.

    Though Kannada is grouped under the Dravidian Languages , it is closer to Sanskrit in Grammar and Alphabets.

    Tamil, unlike the Sanskrit Language does not have Phonetic differentiation for Alphabets.

    Tamil has Alphabets dispenses with this and Tamil Grammar ,dating back to at least 5000 years, has unique system to replace the Phonetic content as displayed in Sanskrit.

    Kannada follows the Sanskrit Grammar patters.

    But words resemble ancient chaste Tamil words of yore.

    ‘Oota‘ means Food in Kannada.

    In ancient Tamil,’Oottam’ means nourishment.

    ‘Angai’ denotes palms in Kannada which is the purest word meaning the same in Tamil-of course this word is scarcely used now.

    It may be noted that some Pallava Kings Mahendravarman and Narasimhavarman are reported to know the language of Pulakesin II.

    However excavations in Vellore ,Tamil Nadu dating back to 18th Century AD has Kannada inscriptions.

    Beyond this there seems to be no reference  in ancient Tamil or Sanskrit Texts.

    I came across an interesting article on the relationship between Sanskrit and Kannada.

    ”

    KANNADA – The Root of all Indian Languages..!!
    Has anybody tried to notice Kannada alphabets and relate to vedic symbols ?

    ಪ – the letter ‘pa’ .. The leter symbolizing padmaasana , this letter can be compared to symbol where a person sitting in padmasana posture.
    ಶ – the letter ‘sha’ .. the letter symbolizing ‘conch’ which is very much used in vedic culture..
    ಷ – the letter ‘Sha’ .. the letter symbolizes person with sacred thread in sitting posture.. you can imagine a ‘ruShi‘..
    ನಿ – the letter ‘ni’ .. tamil claim a (IVC)symbol of god in sitting position.. But has anybody notice this symbol is a kannada letter..

    Note that among south indian languages Kannada and its grammar is very close to sanskrit.. Looks like the kannada region was the first place where mostly occupied by vedic people.. But population density was very less compare to other regions of south india and able to retain sanskrit and its grammatical structure during kannada language evolution..ofco­urse kannada is also very old same as Tamil/telugu/­malalalam..

    Devanagari script seems some what derivative of kannada script.

    If kannada alphabet like ka ಕ is rotated 90 degrees, you can see it looks like devanagari ‘ka’ क

    To me it looks like grantha,devanag­ari, tamil script more probably tries to avoid curves. They are straightened so that suitable for writing on stones/rocks or wooden surfaces.

    But base original picture must have been from kannada/vedic symbols which brahmins initially might have tried to write on leaves most probably used by brahmins..

    As kannada region were famous for ancient saints (majority brahmins/­maharshis), they might have tried to write on leaves.. May be they lost as its not so easy to preserve writings on leaves..

    Moreover brahmins software kind of people who actually work on development of countries, whose main playground was TN/AP regions where they really worked on..

    But those regions were occupied by primitive people and could not preserve sanskrit language , its grammar led to development of new languages like kannada,telugu,­tamil,malayalam­..

    I think initial script creation depended on many factors for example:
    * the tools available for writing.
    * The surface on which writing is to be done.

    https://www.facebook.com/OldestLanguage/posts/136378789856982

     

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